Amplifier FAQ

[AnotherBobDylan]

A troll is someone who makes claims without evidence. That was, really, my point.

The point about the PA is that most people have pedals, and use the tube amp as a PA. But PA's switched to transistors a long time ago. On the other hand, if you actually think a clean tube amp 'colors' the sound that a transistor amp cannot, then perhaps what is needed is a EQ pedal. Or two.

In any event, these arguments are just suggestive in nature due to the lack of any real evidence.

[Meeeoww]

if you actually think a clean tube amp 'colors' the sound that a transistor amp cannot, then perhaps what is needed is a EQ pedal. Or two.

Have you ever actually played a tube amp? Like i said, you simply cannot dispute the fact that tubes sound different than transistors. They are completely different animals dynamically. I don't know why you think the difference is some sort of conspiracy, but you're simply wrong.

[AKA Ninja]

Look, whether the troll is going to get fed or not, let's please not do it in the amp FAQ. This is not the place for it.

Start a new thread in the bedroom about this.

[AnotherBobDylan]

Well, the only thing I want in the FAQ is some recognition of the fact that there is very little evidence to support the idea that tubes are better than transistors, and in fact a lot of suggestive evidence to refute it - as I explained earlier.  And also it gives beginners - who are likely not to spend a lot on their first purchase, a biased viewed of what amp to buy - which is really one of the main purposes of the FAQ, I think.

I recently compared, for example,  the Fender XD tube amp with the Roland Cube 40 watt and the Boss blows the Fender away, in my opinion.

And, a lot of inexperienced guitar players are into distortion pedals which make the difference between tube amps and transistor amps to be minimal.

[Jamesssssssss]

I give my reccomendation for the little fender practice amps, currently borrowing my buddies FM25 to use to run vocals through at rehersal, plugged in my guitar last night and it sounds great! The distortion SUCKS but for a nice loud clean and crunchy sound its great. Real nice with keyboards too, the extra wattage can handle them better than my laney which gets all squelchy at only 15w. Nice dark reverb on it too.

[Larry]

Well, the only thing I want in the FAQ is some recognition of the fact that there is very little evidence to support the idea that tubes are better than transistors

Well that is just hogwash.  We only put facts in the FAQ. 

Tubes are nice and warm sounding.  Transistors are sterile sounding.

[Larry]

And, a lot of inexperienced guitar players are into distortion pedals which make the difference between tube amps and transistor amps to be minimal.

an overdrive or distortion pedal will sound a lot different in front of a tube amp than it will in front of a solid state amp.

[Larry]

I find the lack of evidence here astounding. Here we are, one more internet site in the 21st century, still saying the same thing over and over, with no shred (no pun intended) of evidence to back up anything claimed.

I don't think there is any real evidence to support the idea that tubes are much better than transistors.  The even vs. odd harmonic debate is not really credible - people can't hear this stuff. There is certainly no evidence that they can.  You would think if this were a serious issue someone would just set up a double blind test and settle it once and for all.

I also fell for the power vs preamp distortion myth as well.

I think you can sort of get an idea of the over hype of the tube vs. transistor debate based on the evidence that PA systems use transistors and no one complains.  In fact, no other instrument amp still uses tubes for their amps. Also, most people use pedals to get their distortion. Thus, the tube amp is often a glorified PA system.

I find your post void of evidence.

[Larry]

Let me make a clarification about something.  And of course this is my opinion.  If you are listening to a recording of an amp, you might be able to get real close and fool some people with an amp sim.  However if you are standing in front of an amp playing it, it's much harder to get that solid state amp to sound like a tube amp.  That is not to say you can't get a good sound from a SS amp.  I am just saying it won't sound as warm as a tube amp.

[GregH]

Seems like a good way to resolve this would be, go to a music store (not Guitar Center or Sam Ashe where you can't ascertain what your hearing at any given time) with a SS amp and a tube one. Of course there are differences there as well as there are differing qualities of tube and differing qualities of SS amps but.....say you're comparing a SS Marshall and a Tube Marshall (or Vox or......). If the SS amp sounds as good as the tube amp then buy the SS amp and save yourself a significant amount of money. Oh,it would be worth it to get someone from the store that can get the best coming from both amps....another reason for not going to GC or SA music stores (I don't have anything against the two stores....heck I've spent a good bit of money in both, but there's not real reliability on the abilities of some of their sales people)

It's just to many of us the tube amp always comes out sounding better. Similarly, most professional musicians (and amp gurus I've spoken to) seem to feel the same. But...heck it could just be that many of just got duped by said amp gurus (along the same way as high end stereo addicts that think those amps too should be tube--and listen to records rather than CDs--Oh, and no I haven't put $50000 into a sound system). Anyway..if after all of this you think the SS amp is as good (or better) than the tube amp then that's fine, just put it forwards as your opinion in the same way Larry just did, so yours is put forward as your differing opinion.

[Meeeoww]

if after all of this you think the SS amp is as good (or better) than the tube amp then that's fine, just put it forwards as your opinion in the same way Larry just did, so yours is put forward as your differing opinion.

Yep...If it sounds good, it IS good! But that doesn't change the fact that there is a large market for tube amps, since many people happen to prefer them...

[Larry]

The problem with this whole argument is that "better" or "best" is subjective.  It all comes down to personal opinion.  If someone likes the sound of solid state better than a tube amp that is their opinion.  I don't believe it is the majority opinion.  But then again there are different styles of music for a reason.

[Mushroony]

What my problem is with this whole thing is that a new member comes in here, states that what all guitarists agree on for the past 30 years (or since SS amps got developped) is a bunch of lies, that all guitarists are tube snobs and are just not open minded enough to see there is no difference at all.

And that in a topic of which I know AK put a s#!tload of work in to assemble the info for and write it out.

THIS pisses me off. Really.

Get some ears and sense for dynamics!

[BobRoss]

Couldn´t agree more.

[GregH]

Well, the only thing I want in the FAQ is some recognition of the fact that there is very little evidence to support the idea that tubes are better than transistors

Well that is just hogwash.  We only put facts in the FAQ.  

Tubes are nice and warm sounding.  Transistors are sterile sounding.

I'm sorry if I've come in as a new member and offended everyone.....it was more a matter of simply saying that you should buy what you like--be it tube or SS, but the tone from tube amps are GENERALLY viewed more highly. Also, an FAQ would generally be based upon either a number of experts (or at least an attitude considered widely shared). Hence I felt that if someone really had a differing opinion it should simply be put forward as such rather than question the more general opinion found expressed in the FAQ. (oh and just as a note I have yet to find a SS amp that comes anywhere close to my Mesa....but that is MY opinion).